i have a fantastic database driven website using php and mysql all designed and developed by myself on xp using wamp!!! it proves i have half a brain! agreed?!

…but i still can’t get me head around linux and ip addressing, tcp/ip and have also to worry abut security. right! isnt that the main reason for wanting linux?

so, will some nice nixer although not willing to produce a GUI to make it really easy for the masses at least pleeeeze provide a complete guide to getting a php/mqysql/apache webserver running on a linux…. yes plz every command!

i can find some bits here and there but they are too hard to put all togther – plz do a proper guide step-by-step missng nothing out… and help stop the world domination of MicroSoft.

do you know there must be thousnds of peole like me, most probably ditching linux in the end because the learning curve is too high and linux isnt properly documented for ordinary folks to comprehend.

i bought books on linux and apache – but none show me how to get the whole thing done??

thank you.

All the best.

A Touchy & Religious *NX User

If you’re after a PC which also runs a web server then it might be better to install Ubuntu Desktop and then add Apache, Mysql, PHP to that install.

If you want a ‘Server Appliance’ then there are Linux distros that offer that ability – they tend to use Web based interfaces for ‘GUI management’

If you hate the GUI so much, I am sure you do not use a GUI on your desktop? I am sure it is more efficient and faster to edit pictures, do animation, browse the internet etc. in CLI?

Let me tell you something: A WELL DESIGNED gui is very often better than CLI. It can lay all options out for you so you do not have to remember long commandstrings. It will take care of spelling and syntax, so you do not have to waste your time retyping things because of errors.

But more important than anything: It lowers the barriers for people that come from other OS’es. People that might be very familiar with networking concepts, but they don’t know any commandline stuff, because they have been used to an adequat gui for the tasks they need to do.

Why is everyone so hung up on webservers? I could not care less most of the time. If I need a webserver, I hire space on a server with cPanel.

The servers I need are workgroup servers, file and print servers for the LAN. They will not have any more contact with the internet than any general desktop PC. So if you are concerned about security for the server, you really should be concerned about the security of the desktop systems.

A lot of small companies, organisations, churches, government offices could use a server. No need for a rackmount , but it would be placed in something that could be thought of as a server room. Or maybe not even that.

For these people, a gui is a must have. And why not build on the knowledge they hopefully already have?

I have installed Ubuntu Server at home, and ended up installing KDE on top of it. I have been using Linux in various shapes and sizes for many years, and like CLI less and less. I do not want to use my day running a server and memorizing CLI commands. I don’t care if there are tools that might help. I really do not like CLI!

KDE has a very ok application to configure Samba. It is a great start and I wish there would be more config tools following. Apache, php, mySQL, bind9, ldap, cups and a few others.

Yes, I know there are webinterfaces, but I really prefer ONE consistent interface that has been designed to fit all the underlying structure of the distro. Webmin does not always fit with the distro you want to use it on, so all modules will not work perfect.

I suggest a Kubuntu Server that is stripped for all “user/office” applications, uses the same nice graphical installer as the Kubuntu Desktop, gives the same options that you get while installing Ubuntu Server, and has config applets that can set most things for the different parts of the server.

It could also be stripped for all “eyecandy” so it becomes as light as possible.

I am sure a Kubuntu expert could do a basic image in a couple of days (a stripped down Kubuntu Desktop) and then it would be up to those that are positive to this idea to find or make the missing tools.

I wonder why people that do not like this idea take the time to comment? You already have your toy – Ubuntu Server. Why not be happy with that and stop pestering every discussion with your opinions? The fact that you CAN post here does not mean you SHOULD.

The point of this post is not to discuss IF a gui is needed. That has already been established. You might have a different opinion, and I support your freedom to have that. Just do not push it on me.

Asserting that you need a GUI to administer Linux is – forgive me for being direct – dangerously stupid.

Reasons: at least 3.

1. Lightness and stability: when you install a server it’s for years. The oldest one I manage is a 9 years old filserver with RedHat 9. Can’t update anything as I have to recompile the shit out of it, but it’s doing its job well so there’s no reason to bother (security is not a problem since only a couple of services are exposed and only to the local net). Therefore, you don’t need unnecessary software.

2. Command line is often shorter. Try reloading a service by GUI: open the tool, locate the service, find the toolbar, click Reload. Compare that to reusing the command line and typing a path and “reload”. With tab completion, it comes down to 15 keystrokes for, say, apache.

See for yourself:
[root@*** ~]# date
Sun Jun 7 00:04:15 EEST 2009
[root@*** ~]# /etc/init.d/httpd reload
dReloading httpd: ate
[ OK ]
[root@*** ~]# date
Sun Jun 7 00:04:20 EEST 2009

As you can see, I started typing the second ‘date’ command before the reload output has even completed.

Of course, adding users in different back-ends can be tedious, but what’s stopping you from installing a web based GUI? Or writing you own provisioning scripts? I find Webmin/Virtualmin or SWAT rather easy to use (though SWAT is quite ugly and ugly doesn’t go well with usability), there’s not need for a whole desktop manager to add an user.

3. Servers and services often crash. They do it under heavy load, by luser error, from security issues, software dependencies and many more. When they do, it’s time to get down and dirty with the lowest level tools available. If you’re not used (correction: proficient) with the command line and Google search you’re a defenseless victim, a sheep in the woods, at night, in winter. As far as I know, there’s no GUI for GRUB setup or kernel compiling (as in a Gnome or QT app).

Other than that, installing a desktop manager is trivial under most distribution. I sometimes install a lightweight one. I do it either for the moronic Windows admin – who’s required by the client to look at the server from time to time – or in order to have a desktop in the local net, without taking hold of a workstation. Of course, I only start it when I need it.

What type of magically amazingly hard to configure server are you trying to run anyway? It’s not as if Samba, Apache or CUPS is hard to configure if you actually read the documentation (all of which easily can be run on a desktop-oriented distribution as well).

That said, why Ubuntu server? I love what the Ubuntu team has been doing on the desktop but why do you need cutting edge server applications in the repos? Debian does the job just fine and it’s not like they don’t push necessary security updates when needed. For a server you want rock solid stability, reliability, security and performance first and foremost. The day I rely on the stability of xorg to handle a high priority machine on my network is the day I stop using Linux and might as well buy Windows Server licenses (not bloody likely).

It’s built on the stability of Red Hat, without having to pay for the support subscription.

It has the available GUI or non-GUI as you so choose.

It includes some apps for managing Samba, Apache and others for the GUI.

The NetInstall CD is very small and this way you download and install just what you want AND the latest version of the applications instead of what they put on the CD that your downloaded and burned.

For any of the servers, though, I’ve found some help at HotToForge.org, including reading through some of their “Perfect Server” tutorials.